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Post by Canucksoldier on Jun 26, 2007 15:37:45 GMT -5
sd2r qualified after TheClash scored 5 pts in OCC giving us 7 pts.. NOT 2 by the end of saturday.. so 7>5... thats how Yes and the OCC is a cton event and had to be manually added to the MET standings, to update the points standings. CS
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Post by eiffel on Jun 26, 2007 16:00:29 GMT -5
If the rules really say that only the first 7 events allows qualification for sunday, then it's a mistake. It's always been the results after all friday and saturday events are played.
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Juni
Worker
Posts: 137
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Post by Juni on Jun 27, 2007 6:29:52 GMT -5
I released 3 new maps scripts, improving land on Ring, Hub and Wheel. These maps could be really interesting for Ironman IMO, so I invite all Ironman players to download these maps HERE and try them.
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Post by penny on Jun 27, 2007 6:58:07 GMT -5
I released 3 new maps scripts, improving land on Ring, Hub and Wheel. These maps could be really interesting for Ironman IMO, so I invite all Ironman players to download these maps HERE and try them. Thanks a lot Juni, I back you up on this Just try those maps and you'll be convinced I reckon we use it for Ironman, and probably UQC event. BTW, do we plan on usinf BTS for next CCC, and if so, do we plan on having UQC events (or any type of MOD)?
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Post by SweViking on Jun 27, 2007 7:41:52 GMT -5
My reflections after this CCC: Case´s software in making brackets still sucks. Some get bye and have to wait when they could have played vs each other. Sometimes 1 bracket is done and one team is waiting for final while other bracket is still playing 2nd round. If this cant be sorted in future i suggest that TD make this manually. Cant be that hard, just split all clans for every event. Ex. MUD vs RAY event 1 (first round). Event 2 MUD can not meet RAY in event 2 (round 1) etc etc. A other idea is to set rank number after last CCC. in first round and TD make a lottery like world cup in soccer. Example on friday to saturday. (if lets say 13 clans again)First of all, every top 7 clan gets a draw on start order in the bracket. (7 notes in a bowl with the clan names) First clan to be drawn from the bowl get spot 1. (highest up in bracket) 2nd to be drawn gets 3rd slot from top in bracket. etc etc. (slot 7, 8, 15 and 16 will be closed due it is 13 clans to make both brackets even) I hope you follow me, im bad at explaining... After this is done: TOP 7 clans will be drawn to bottom 6 and 1 "bye" vote. (bye vote must be in slot 2,4,10 or 12) (if 13 clans) For this last CCC, MDR will draw first, then Ray and so on until all 7 clans have a opponent. (Remark, TD make this draws, top clans dont pick) In this way we get a compomiss to mookies example of divisional CCC. Anyway, ithink it will be more fair and play time more effective. All will play round 1 when event start exept 1 clan if its a uneven lineup with clans. (11,13,15 etc) (some will say, hey then some will end up in SEMI-final after only playing 1 game in round 1. BUT its same as today when you get a bye in first round and only plays quarter final to get to semi.) Its a problem we will have unless we get 16 clans or 8 clans. Atleast the boring wait if you get a bye first round is minimized. (For all TD around there, this will take about 5 min of your time only so dont worry ;D) I can even make a exel file for you And on sunday...Top4 clans will be drawn a slot number. (slot 1,3,5,7) Top4 will be drawn to bottom 4 clans due to friday and saturdays score. (will be much more easy since we have a even "8") Idont wanna say there is any "easy" games in CCC because there isent. BUT with my own experience a game with MUD vs RAY/GOD/MDR is often much looonger then to another clan in general. With this seeding process we make round 1 in time more even (in most cases) between both brackets atleast. And...We need to seriously either increase turn timer OR decrease turn limit. Medi, renny and indu are horrible long. Maybe not a big issue for the ones that dont make it to the final, but thrust me.. 4 renny inland sea games in a row is a killer. Play, wait,play, wait etc.. etc... took me 13 hours to complete that event this CCC. started 8 in the evening and was done 9.30 in the morning... If my girlfriend been home she would sent me to the doctor and throw my computer in the trash And...I made a own thread on this in the wrong place maybe... But i personally think the modern map is awful.( See my other thread in main of this CCC thread) Other then that ithink it was a fun and exiting CCC and look forward to another ;D // Swe the berserk ;D
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Post by toratoratora on Jun 27, 2007 10:03:59 GMT -5
Ok Swe devide 13 into 2 whatever you do 1 team will always get a Bye if all 14 clans register its fine its actually even better when 16 clans register for CCC and play all events then theres no Byes PS you should apply to Be a TD if its so easy 1 idea might be to change the rules regards CCC roster registration making it if its a ODD mumber of clans say 13 register for CCC then say the number of clans needs to be a even amount say only the 1st 12 rosters register get to play ;D
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Post by stetson on Jun 27, 2007 12:25:57 GMT -5
I understand that SD2R got 5 points in Event 8, and that those points weren't added until afterwards, and that SD2R had 7 points by the end of Saturday... But those are not the rules as stated in the CCC schedule... Look at Event 10. It clearly states that the top 8 teams "AFTER EVENT 7" qualify for this event... not AFTER THE FIRST TWO DAYS... Given this, FUN had more points after event 7, because the 5 points in the UQC game would not have counted for qualifying...
I don't post this out of hate for SD2R, but rather, to make sure that this rule is clear for future CCCs... Personally, I am a fan of having it be "THE FIRST TWO DAYS", but that is not what it says, and this needs to be decided by the next CCC.
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Post by Canucksoldier on Jun 27, 2007 12:36:12 GMT -5
I understand that SD2R got 5 points in Event 8, and that those points weren't added until afterwards, and that SD2R had 7 points by the end of Saturday... But those are not the rules as stated in the CCC schedule... Look at Event 10. It clearly states that the top 8 teams "AFTER EVENT 7" qualify for this event... not AFTER THE FIRST TWO DAYS... Given this, FUN had more points after event 7, because the 5 points in the UQC game would not have counted for qualifying... I don't post this out of hate for SD2R, but rather, to make sure that this rule is clear for future CCCs... Personally, I am a fan of having it be "THE FIRST TWO DAYS", but that is not what it says, and this needs to be decided by the next CCC. Don't worry that administrative error will be fixed for the next CCC. CS
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Post by Lestat on Jun 27, 2007 12:56:45 GMT -5
Ok Swe devide 13 into 2 whatever you do 1 team will always get a Bye if all 14 clans register its fine its actually even better when 16 clans register for CCC and play all events then theres no Byes PS you should apply to Be a TD if its so easy 1 idea might be to change the rules regards CCC roster registration making it if its a ODD mumber of clans say 13 register for CCC then say the number of clans needs to be a even amount say only the 1st 12 rosters register get to play ;D No comment...only quote
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Post by Bonsai on Jun 27, 2007 13:01:03 GMT -5
I understand that SD2R got 5 points in Event 8, and that those points weren't added until afterwards, and that SD2R had 7 points by the end of Saturday... But those are not the rules as stated in the CCC schedule... Look at Event 10. It clearly states that the top 8 teams "AFTER EVENT 7" qualify for this event... not AFTER THE FIRST TWO DAYS... Given this, FUN had more points after event 7, because the 5 points in the UQC game would not have counted for qualifying... I don't post this out of hate for SD2R, but rather, to make sure that this rule is clear for future CCCs... Personally, I am a fan of having it be "THE FIRST TWO DAYS", but that is not what it says, and this needs to be decided by the next CCC. That might be legacy error, since some events were added in recent history. It should certainly be fixed in the rules. IMO it makes no sense to not count any events towards the Sunday qualification. What's the point of having them then? Thanks, Juni, for providing the new maps. They are very much needed to fix some of the issues with the standard maps and provide some more variety. Hopefully we get some traction for this. I think it would also be nice to play for the third place in teamers instead of giving each team that lost in the semis two points. That would mean even more games obviously, but make the play-off style used in these events more interesting. To a limited extend it would also reduce the impact of the bracket selection randomness. I like SweViking's proposal a lot to use a clan's past CCC performance for a seeding scheme dividing the clans in two groups. It could also be done on an event-to-event basis. In the last CCC I played in four teamers and in each first game we played we faced one of the top three teams - besides GOD. Some randomness is good to make it interesting, but that seems excessive to me...
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Post by SweViking on Jun 27, 2007 14:13:46 GMT -5
PS you should apply to Be a TD if its so easy If you have half a brain and can count up to 20 its no problem for a TD. And i can be a TD, no problem for me. But since im a member of MUD and often competes for nr1 in CCC i guess i will be called a cheater if somehow the lottery is in "good ways" for my clan. Only problem is that idont know if the TD can manually set up the brackets in a tourney... If that is possible this is a piece of a cake to set up. And a much better way then the one we have today.
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Post by MookieNJ on Jul 5, 2007 17:18:50 GMT -5
Anyone think a 2v2v2v2 Event would be fun? I think it would be kind of cool and it's an underutilized style of play. Pass. Don't need a team event that could turn out to be "gang up on the leader," "everyone hates MUD lets all attack them," etc.
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Post by toratoratora on Jul 6, 2007 1:20:44 GMT -5
all HB maps need climate set to tropical 9/10 times this guarantees all players to get their OIL I have tested this a few times now Thanks to lestat for pointing this out to me so for the OCC HB TBG V 3 (Dont know where to get it from but i can mail you a copy ) maps are cool if the climate is set to Tropical OIL is a plenty this map can also be used for all renny- Future team events
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Post by metallian on Jul 6, 2007 3:45:10 GMT -5
I like SWE's idea allot as I did Mookie's divisional CCC idea. The amount of down time between games is what makes the events so long. Sunday always seems to run smoothly with 8 clans, however Friday and Saturday always seem drag on forever. Last CCC we had the Ren, the CTON, the Future, and the IND all being played at once. I know for a fact RaY had to do allot of shuffling just to fill these event, nevermind the fact we had players playing events they hadn't practiced for. To have the IND, REN and future within a 7-8 hour time frame is unacceptable. Those events generally take the longest yet we have all of them being played on Friday or early Saturday morning. I actually don't like increasing the turn timer speed because it really takes away from the team play element of civ. When high powered clans play each other they generally know the game is over and when it's time to conceed, I know for a fact that RaY and MDR have had epic battles in the ccc and they generally finish within a reasonable timeframe because both teams know when the gig is up. Generally RaY can play using the blazing and fast turn timers, however we have a TS server and we all speak pretty good English, this is not the case for all clans out there. I would suggest keeping the timer speeds where they are.
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Post by Canucksoldier on Jul 6, 2007 8:15:19 GMT -5
Well unfortunately we can not manually set up the brackets in the tournaments to do what Swe is suggesting. And while I don't have a issue with a divisional CCC in principle, it's not practical untill we have 16 solid clans, which we don't have now.
CS
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Post by deyreepher on Jul 6, 2007 8:47:55 GMT -5
My reflections after this CCC: Case´s software in making brackets still sucks. Some get bye and have to wait when they could have played vs each other. Sometimes 1 bracket is done and one team is waiting for final while other bracket is still playing 2nd round. If this cant be sorted in future i suggest that TD make this manually. Cant be that hard, just split all clans for every event. Ex. MUD vs RAY event 1 (first round). Event 2 MUD can not meet RAY in event 2 (round 1) etc etc. A other idea is to set rank number after last CCC. in first round and TD make a lottery like world cup in soccer. Example on friday to saturday. (if lets say 13 clans again)First of all, every top 7 clan gets a draw on start order in the bracket. (7 notes in a bowl with the clan names) First clan to be drawn from the bowl get spot 1. (highest up in bracket) 2nd to be drawn gets 3rd slot from top in bracket. etc etc. (slot 7, 8, 15 and 16 will be closed due it is 13 clans to make both brackets even) I hope you follow me, im bad at explaining... After this is done: TOP 7 clans will be drawn to bottom 6 and 1 "bye" vote. (bye vote must be in slot 2,4,10 or 12) (if 13 clans) For this last CCC, MDR will draw first, then Ray and so on until all 7 clans have a opponent. (Remark, TD make this draws, top clans dont pick) In this way we get a compomiss to mookies example of divisional CCC. Anyway, ithink it will be more fair and play time more effective. All will play round 1 when event start exept 1 clan if its a uneven lineup with clans. (11,13,15 etc) (some will say, hey then some will end up in SEMI-final after only playing 1 game in round 1. BUT its same as today when you get a bye in first round and only plays quarter final to get to semi.) Its a problem we will have unless we get 16 clans or 8 clans. Atleast the boring wait if you get a bye first round is minimized. (For all TD around there, this will take about 5 min of your time only so dont worry ;D) I can even make a exel file for you And on sunday...Top4 clans will be drawn a slot number. (slot 1,3,5,7) Top4 will be drawn to bottom 4 clans due to friday and saturdays score. (will be much more easy since we have a even "8") Idont wanna say there is any "easy" games in CCC because there isent. BUT with my own experience a game with MUD vs RAY/GOD/MDR is often much looonger then to another clan in general. With this seeding process we make round 1 in time more even (in most cases) between both brackets atleast. And...We need to seriously either increase turn timer OR decrease turn limit. Medi, renny and indu are horrible long. Maybe not a big issue for the ones that dont make it to the final, but thrust me.. 4 renny inland sea games in a row is a killer. Play, wait,play, wait etc.. etc... took me 13 hours to complete that event this CCC. started 8 in the evening and was done 9.30 in the morning... If my girlfriend been home she would sent me to the doctor and throw my computer in the trash And...I made a own thread on this in the wrong place maybe... But i personally think the modern map is awful.( See my other thread in main of this CCC thread) Other then that ithink it was a fun and exiting CCC and look forward to another ;D // Swe the berserk ;D This is an excellent idea. Not to take the wind out of your sail, but I proposed something like this awhile back, but you did a nice job of it. It's all laid out, all the steps. The only thing missing is for someone to code a page where this can all be displayed through a browser. You get that step done and I think you can get the ladder community to either vote on your proposal SWE. I truly think, if you come up with a working mini-model of what you're proposal, just a web input page, there's no reason why we couldn't give it a chance. Without it, Canuck will shoot your idea down faster than Bush can say "We don't torture". However, I think your proposal is sound and I'm backing you. Watch out for Canuck's 2 step on any sort of changes to the CCC. It's like trying to squeeze water from a stone.
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Post by Canucksoldier on Jul 6, 2007 8:59:20 GMT -5
Dey, I'm not Ghangis Khan you know. But suggestions are only good if we can actually implement them. And Cases doesn't let us do what Swe is suggesting, irrespective of whether it's a good idea in principle. And running the entire CCC manually would likely lead to all sorts of confusion and problems.
CS
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Post by deyreepher on Jul 6, 2007 9:11:05 GMT -5
Dey, I'm not Ghangis Khan you know. But suggestions are only good if we can actually implement them. And Cases doesn't let us do what Swe is suggesting, irrespective of whether it's a good idea in principle. And running the entire CCC manually would likely lead to all sorts of confusion and problems. CS Um...the rosters of the clans participating in the CCC are posted in the forums beforehand. The rules are basically cut and paste for the events. Swe laid out how the teams are seeded. All you need is a scripter to come up with an easy to use script for admin use, not unlike the M.E.T. script. WTF...I'm not asking for a mission to mars. You're basically missing one component to make SWE's idea work. Or am I wrong? Swe has laid out a great idea, give him tangible reasons as to why his idea can't even be considered, you're giving it the cold shoulder. If you tell him the onus is on him to get the scripting done, that's acceptable. Telling him that you've considered and toyed with the idea is leading a guy on. I've seen you do it to me twice without any hard reasons and I sure as hell won't let you do it to Swe, when he has a really great proposal with nearly all the leg work done. Let's go, Round 3...
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Post by Lestat on Jul 6, 2007 9:26:02 GMT -5
all HB maps need climate set to tropical 9/10 times this guarantees all players to get their OIL I have tested this a few times now Thanks to lestat for pointing this out to me so for the OCC HB TBG V 3 (Dont know where to get it from but i can mail you a copy ) maps are cool if the climate is set to Tropical OIL is a plenty this map can also be used for all renny- Future team events Not in all HB maps only in V3. I removed desert,plains from V3. If u put tropical u will got more jungle up and down from equador where is oil and got maybe 1 plain square land. On hb v2 if climate is tropical u will got more desert and plains ... be caerfuly
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Post by Canucksoldier on Jul 6, 2007 9:27:07 GMT -5
Dey, I'm not Ghangis Khan you know. But suggestions are only good if we can actually implement them. And Cases doesn't let us do what Swe is suggesting, irrespective of whether it's a good idea in principle. And running the entire CCC manually would likely lead to all sorts of confusion and problems. CS Um...the rosters of the clans participating in the CCC are posted in the forums beforehand. The rules are basically cut and paste for the events. Swe laid out how the teams are seeded. All you need is a scripter to come up with an easy to use script for admin use, not unlike the M.E.T. script. WTF...I'm not asking for a mission to mars. You're basically missing one component to make SWE's idea work. Or am I wrong? Swe has laid out a great idea, give him tangible reasons as to why his idea can't even be considered, you're giving it the cold shoulder. If you tell him the onus is on him to get the scripting done, that's acceptable. Telling him that you've considered and toyed with the idea is leading a guy on. I've seen you do it to me twice without any hard reasons and I sure as hell won't let you do it to Swe, when he has a really great proposal with nearly all the leg work done. Let's go, Round 3... I'm not saying his idea can't be considered, I'm saying we don't have the infrastructure to do that right now, even if we wanted too. And if we did code our own tournament software page, we would still have to manually report all the matches to Cases in the end(getting reports from all the cton events players is problematic sometimes now as it is). The MET server is relatively simple as it just "parses" data from the Cases tournament pages and displays the data the way we want it. And even then it has occasional issues that we have to manually fix. I guess it comes down to the issue of how much work is required to do this as opposed to how much benefit there is in changing the way teams are seeded. I'll keep my mind open if some code monkey can deliver something that works as well as Cases for the TD/Admin staff and players. The real issue is just that we don't always have 16 clans and therefore have byes....maybe we could just encourage a few more solid clans to form and stick around and then we wouldn't have to consider re-inventing the wheel. CS
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