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Post by Tony on Mar 31, 2006 16:17:15 GMT -5
yeah i agree,
And nice picture of Commical Fried
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Post by Magzi on Mar 31, 2006 17:00:26 GMT -5
Yes I agree with you elledge but, for many years I was a SP and didn't even try online until a year and a half ago. Once Broadband arrived here (we are a bit slow over here but got it in the end!) and I tried MP...well, SP just doesn't cut it any more Back on topic though...I never used to get much connecting peer problems but now 3 nights running I have problems getting into a game ...Is it me and if so how/why?
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Post by friedrichpsitalon on Mar 31, 2006 18:33:22 GMT -5
MMV has a lot to learn about how publishers work. That's all I can say.
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Post by icecube on Mar 31, 2006 23:14:03 GMT -5
It's looking more and more like they're waiting for the expansion now and I don't see how they could possibly force people to buy a bug-fixing patch but if that's the case I'm out. I don't understand what's taking so long. We don't need a patch that fixes every single balance issue in the game. Not now anyway. We need a patch that fixes all the down-right broken parts of the game that make it impossible to play like the 'retire bug' and 'password bug'. The other day in a game I had a settler dissapear right off the map. I'm still not sure how to explain that and it's not something that's been a real problem but man I looked everywhere for that settler in case I had accidently hit the 'explore' button but man it was just gone.
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Post by MMV on Apr 1, 2006 0:27:07 GMT -5
MMV has a lot to learn about how publishers work. That's all I can say. No, that's not all you could say. As a CIV Admin, game contractor, and tester - you could help "represent" our feelings to the powers-that-be concerning the general consensus of disatisfaction, lack of customer support, and an anticpated patch that complicated multi-player more than three months ago. The same CUSTOMER disatisfaction that's registered here, is also equally represented on apolyton and C4SPG. As you stated, there are a lot of things that I or everyone else "may have to learn here" but $49.95 X 1,000,000 and a SINGLE game bug from a +90 day old patch that hampers ladder MP; factored by the same company anouncing "new work" on an expansion pack when "old work" isn't done yet = disatisfaction. I fully understand and empathize here that this is your ladder and your "baby," and have been a HUGE supporter of the game from Day1 including all it's trials and tribulations. All anyone is asking is that someone understands and empathises with us as ladder members and paying customers. I just want to play the game as it's advertised on the box.
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Post by MMV on Apr 1, 2006 0:48:33 GMT -5
Here's an email I sent on 3-17-06 to senior executives at Firaxis and Take2. I also forwarded this same email in snail-mail business letter format to all the same parties. note: I have edited out some specific references in this that are unique to another private forum: Take2 sent a written response to me immediately; no one else has yet responded. ======================== a lot of people in the xEDITEDx forums are asking direct questions regarding status, content, fix-list, etc of the pending CIV X.XX patch - without response.
http://xEDITEDx in this thread, I asked several questions and got one answer from XXXX for all the questions I asked. His response was telling me where and how to find a list of "release notes" that he had JUST posted xEDITEDx.
XXXX also stated in his post that "X.XX fixes a great deal of the problems" but many threads, bugs, etc have been posted since then in addition to the other posts/game notes that have not been responded to.
I'm sorry XXXX, but as both customers and xEDITEDx, we're not getting any "warm fuzzy" feelings over this.
ALL of the multi-player (MP) community, as well as a lot of xEDITEDx feel more than a bit "abandoned" with this lack or response.
Game connectivity is a MAJOR ISSUE within the MP community and we as both players xEDITEDx see no reflection to this being addressed in a product that overwhelmingly advertised this as one of it's strongest and greatest assets.
As a past game tester of many other products, I'm well aware of the "constraints" due to reduced "post-release" developer/programmer/manpower assets but as has been asked in the XXXX forums, we've been given NO CLUE as to the release of a patch that would fix yet unaddressed problems since the original game release (over five months ago), the first patch, or the current patch which came out nearly 90 days ago.
We see more information about PitBoss and PBEM games from XXXX (again, with little response) than we do for any other issues identified by XXXX. Perhaps we don't understand that you may be "responding" by "fixing" things that are posted ( thanks! ), but response is also letting us know about it (feed-back for the feed-back we were solicited for and offered to you).
We've suggested that the current pending patch fix/address the primary bugs and problems instead of trying to add new things (and hence more possible problems) - but with no or little response. Actually, the response has been that there is "nothing new being worked on" and that the majority of issues have been fixed with the impending patch.
Finding out through a "news release" - session.apolyton.xEDITEDx that there is now an expansion pack in the works when primary issues of the current game have yet to be fully addressed (nor released to the public) is EXTREMELY disenhearting. Product assets are available for this yet not available for the current game usability problems or the feedback we were solicted for?
As I asked in my original posting xEDITEDx that we're looking for reassurances to the many ongoing unresolved issues and processes. Please take a moment from your day and respond.
Regards
XXXX XXXX XXXX[/i]
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Post by salqadri on Apr 1, 2006 3:48:33 GMT -5
Nice stuff MMV! Firaxis just seems like a pretty lazy company, though maybe just from the outside. Thanks for your efforts and information.
I dunno how much Fried knows about publishing games, but Fried what we're talking about is what the company Take2 themselves are claiming, so how can you possibly refute that? Fried man, and you too Canuck, you guys are supposed to represent us in front of Firaxis, not me or MMV or whoever else. Instead, you guys work against us! We're YOUR community. Your loyalty should be with us first because you are our admins, then Firaxis. If you disagree, please explain. I have not seen one post from either of you about anything even slightly against them. Again, take a look at the names of all the people I have quoted; these are all ppl that post regularly, thus are important members of the community you guys are admins of. Respect our opinions and views, and portray them to Firaxis since they will listen to you first, atleast over me or MMV.
Btw, I noticed a lot of people here are worried that the patch will be the expansion. Well I can assure you that this is NOT the case. The patch will be the last patch before the expansion, with the intention of completing Civ4 to the level as it was "advertised on the box", including hotseat, bugfixes etc. So please dont worry about having to pay for the patch.
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Post by Sidhe on Apr 1, 2006 5:33:01 GMT -5
I have no idea how Firaxis work and frankly I don't care, I want a patch to fix the errors last month and I want it then, since they have all been fixed this stalling is intolerable, patch now anything else is just fobbing people off with lameness, wow I have gone a whole month without playing CIV that's amazing? Good work firaxis this pile is annoying the hell out of everyone, fix it I'm bored of reading all the complaints. CanuckSoldier and others have stated that it's in final testing, but it seems like people have been saying it was imminent for weeks or even a few months. I'm in your boat, LP - if they release the patch with the expansion or the patch is unsatisfactory I'm done with C4. If it's good, great, and I'll probably buy the expansion to boot. On a side note, are you implying that the only way you will be able to obtain the patch is with the release of an expansion, or that you will only be able to download the patch after the expansion comes out. If it's the former I can assure you CIV MP is going straight in the bin, if I have to buy some lame expansion on top of the 25 quid I already payed then as far as I'm concerned you can stick CIV up where the sun don't shine. It's been a blast sionara. I'm sure it's the latter though, well I hope it is. I enjoyed playing CIV before the patch came out, now it's bumbling shell of a game which has had the soul ripped out of it by coding errors. Nice Job Salqadri, a well meaning thread that would I imagine be ignored by anyone remotely connected with Firaxis? If you want to ask why the patch isn't out I suggest people write lots of letters to Firaxis in the style of Shawshank Redemption, maybe that'll work
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Post by zzZhenon on Apr 1, 2006 5:36:53 GMT -5
I'm not trying to promote NWN, it's a completely different style of game. But as a starting point for what I think a good company gives in patches, here's the current patch number it is on and IS STILL PATCHING despite 4 years since the original came out and 2 years since the final expansion came out: 1.67
What does this mean? 67 patches!!
That means somebody, whether it was Atari or the game designers -- BioWare -- has come out with 67 improved versions of their game.
Take heed please Firaxis.
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Post by Sidhe on Apr 1, 2006 8:25:42 GMT -5
Not quite CIV had 1.19 then 1.52 This means version 1 with 52 minor ammendments, whether these are specific coding ammendments or changes of a broader nature are beside the point The next patch say 1.97 will have 35 minor changes over 1.52 Or they may just go vith V2 in which case the pach is a major overhaul. Frankly it'd better be miraculous with all the time it's taking
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Post by zzZhenon on Apr 1, 2006 14:55:09 GMT -5
Hmm I forgot that they jump sometimes... I recall them jumping from 1.4x to 1.60 when the last expansion came out. So that's still 7 patches in the last expansion alone -- not as good as I was thinking originally. The only time they jumped patch numbers was when each of the two expansions came out. I would guesstimate that there was at least 25+ true patches and that they fixed more than one thing per patch. Here's a list of what they fixed in 1.67 for example: nwn.bioware.com/support/patchdetails166.html?pl=
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Post by Sidhe on Apr 1, 2006 16:53:29 GMT -5
Absolutely reading the link a good point, it's just not totally indicative of that many patches, but obviously some game companies value the views of their "proletariat" over others? good, point well made. From the brief time I spent on the inside I will not chastise Firaxis, they are trying hard to make a good game for their customers, all I will say is that they should learn that fixing something quick will keep people happy(even if it is a quick fix) letting it slide for a long time will provoke anger.
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Post by Gogf on Apr 1, 2006 18:41:46 GMT -5
Salqadri, please stop releasing private information from the nonpublic patch beta forums. It was made clear that all information there is NOT to be released to the public.
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Post by friedrichpsitalon on Apr 1, 2006 19:33:17 GMT -5
Salaqdri's posts have been removed. One further violation will lead to his expulsion from that forum and a suspension on this one.
MMV - do you really think I haven't been expressing our concerns? That's all I can say, but use your head. I am by no means an idiot, nor are Firaxians. The rest you'll have to put together for yourself, but there are real people involved here, and none of them like non-working products, and none of them - contrary to some opinions here - are moneyleeching crooks.
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Post by Avogadro on Apr 1, 2006 20:12:01 GMT -5
So they have retained a few full time programmers working on the issue?
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Post by MMV on Apr 1, 2006 23:39:32 GMT -5
Salaqdri's posts have been removed. One further violation will lead to his expulsion from that forum and a suspension on this one. MMV - do you really think I haven't been expressing our concerns? That's all I can say, but use your head. I am by no means an idiot, nor are Firaxians. The rest you'll have to put together for yourself, but there are real people involved here, and none of them like non-working products, and none of them - contrary to some opinions here - are moneyleeching crooks. Fried - in ALL sincerity, THANK YOU for posting SOMETHING that is reassuring (as asked). ANY type of communication helps (please consider posting similar communications in another forum as "some" are moving to a level of flaming - your posts and presense there would CERTAINLY help). My effort is "better communication" (or SOME communication, lol) - NOT "faster patches" or "efficient patches" there is a "general" post there now regarding a request for the powers to implement a "mute button" in the forums......... The irony and symbolism of that (in context) is rather funny, lol.
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Post by salqadri on Apr 2, 2006 2:30:48 GMT -5
Salaqdri's posts have been removed. One further violation will lead to his expulsion from that forum and a suspension on this one. Which post? *scratching head*. Whatever it was, im sorry. And yes thank you for telling us that you have been expressing your concerns to them.
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Post by GERMANIA on Apr 2, 2006 4:16:59 GMT -5
Well i don't get what your guys problem are we all know that take2 is a company who needs to make money to alive and we had also XP in Civ3 and no one ever made those post like this and every kind of good games brings a XP because there been so many who enjoyed the game ( even if it took abit longer for me to enjoy this game ) and who would be happy to get some new stuff in... And about the patch well i think they learned one thing about it, its better to wait a bit and bring a patch out, witch has no new bugs and really fix all old one.. and 1,52 inst that bad ore And yes the XP gone be the ladder version how it been always in the past... And for those who are so unhappy about civ there are many other good games out maybe try those
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Post by Sidhe on Apr 2, 2006 10:45:43 GMT -5
I think your missing the point a bit, the game really sucks at the moment I don't see why the build cost and civic exploits and various other exploits couldn't be fixed ASAP, this obviously completely ruined the game, I don't see why they couldn't of released a quick patch for this.All the connection issues might take longer to resolve but I've gone without playing the game for five weeks, simply because it's a waste of time at the moment. I would of liked a quick fix patch along the lines of say something like 1.53 that just resolved the minor issues and a few of the glaringly obvious connection issues. A note saying this is a patch to get rid of the oversights(exploits and a few of the more obvious connection problems a more comprehensive patch will follow) would of been fine, hell I'd go back to playing 1.19 it's better than the 1.52 mess we have now? That's what people are getting at. That's why people are a bit miffed, we're forced to either play the game as it is atm, dreadful as it is, or just sit here twiddling our thumbs waiting for fixes that should of been sorted ASAP post patch not 6 months later. We're annoyed and some would argue rightly so. Players who play MP are graced with more patience than most, but even patience has limits.
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Post by Avogadro on Apr 2, 2006 11:07:36 GMT -5
Since the profits are huge, I also wonder if any full-time programmers remained on task or if they are all working on XP and using a bit of time here and there to fix original?
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