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Post by MMV on Jul 6, 2006 19:08:52 GMT -5
Carthage and their unique unit - Numidian
Celts and their unique unit - Gallic Swordsman
Koreans and their unique unit - Hwacha
Ottomans and their unique unit - Janissaries
Vikings and their unique unit - Berserker
Zulu and their unique unit - Impis
Other than Ottoman Janissaries - these Civs and their unique units seem vaguely familiar (in a deja-civ3'vouz sort of way)
New leader "traits" are wonderful - but unless you play them like the leader that has the specific traits - it doesn't do much. (not to be confused with civilization traits)
Honest oppinion? Won't have much effect on MP play - looks like the game is going more and more completely towards SP.
Will I buy it? Probably When? Not until after the game has been out for a bit (how long - who knows, depends on the reactions of people, especially Firaxis/Take2 support and support staff) GameSpy support? probably the same we have now for C4 - no arcade support. Same problems as C3 and C4? YOU BET, player developed by the same people? same problems! count on it, it's inherent of player developed games.
In the long run, I'll get some enjoyment out of it (but I'm putting ZERO expectations out there that it "adds" much to the game of Civ MP)
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Post by mrsaturn on Jul 6, 2006 23:06:55 GMT -5
My take on the stuff IGN posted-
charismatic- unlike aggressive which gives combat 1 immediately then nothing after, charismatic gives nothing immediately but levels your units 25% faster. I see this as more of a later-game thing, while aggressive is good through the entire game. Also gives +2 happiness to all cities, and cheaper broadcast towers (haha).
protective- gives archer and artillery units Drill I and II, cheaper walls and castles. Decent early on, if you keep going for Drill III. Good for defense.
imperialistic- increases great general rate by 100%, settlers 25% cheaper.
Carthage- financial and charismatic- good teching, good military later on. UU replaces horsearcher with -1 power, +10 % withdraw rate, +50% vs. melee. The power hit hurts if attacking archers in a city, the withdraw rate is negligible, the melee bonus will still get it killed by spears but it has a better chance vs axe defenders. Very situational, so I don't see it being much of a factor. Harbor replacement is negligible (+1 trade routes).
Celts- spiritual and charismatic- no anarchy, good military later on. UU replaces swordsman with Guerilla 1. Laughable- who builds swords to defend hills? Completely useless. Wall replacement is negligible (+guerilla to units if on a hill city). Still might be decent if charismatic is very useful and you want to change civics a lot.
Koreans- financial and protective. UU replaces catapults with +50% vs melee. This seems godly... catapults are critical from ancient to ren, and now they'll kick the snot out of axes. Leader is protective, so these UU will also start with Drill II. You'd better have a handful of horsearchers in your stacks now, or these things will destroy you. Cheaper than cho-ko-nu, too, and can be built much earlier. Korea starts with mysticism and mining, just like Gandhi- you can go for early religion and bronze working easily. If you're fighting Korea, you better get longbows asap or find horses. University replacement (+10% science) is decent for late games.
Ottomans- organized and expansive. UU replaces musketmen with +25% to archers, mounted and melee. If ottomans are one of the first to get muskets, they are unstoppable. They can also expand like crazy with huge cities. Aqueduct replacement is also godly- gives health bonus, as well as +2 happiness! They must get gunpowder first though, otherwise the UU is just mediocre.
Vikings- aggressive and financial (incas will change?) UU replaces macemen with +10% city raider and amphibious. Again, pretty negligible. Lighthouse replaced with +Navigation I to naval units built there (1 extra move). Decent for water maps, otherwise this race is pretty mediocre (decent traits though).
Zulus- aggressive and expansive (Genghis will change?) UU replaces spears with +1 movement with some terrain movement bonus. Stack these with horsearchers and you have some early musketeers. I mostly see these as harassers, though, since axes defend decent vs horses anyway. Barracks replacement (-20% maintenance) I have no idea how useful this is.
So it looks like Korea will rule the early games, Ottomans can get huge cities and will beeline for gunpowder, and everything else seems negligible.
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Post by Elledge on Jul 6, 2006 23:13:48 GMT -5
charismatic- unlike aggressive which gives combat 1 immediately then nothing after, charismatic gives nothing immediately but levels your units 25% faster. I see this as more of a later-game thing, while aggressive is good through the entire game. Also gives +2 happiness to all cities, and cheaper broadcast towers (haha). 25% faster? Does that mean that barracks + theology + vassalage = 8 exp will give level 3 units out of the box?
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Post by Speaker on Jul 6, 2006 23:39:48 GMT -5
25% faster? Does that mean that barracks + theology + vassalage = 8 exp will give level 3 units out of the box? Nope
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Post by MookieNJ on Jul 6, 2006 23:40:04 GMT -5
25% faster? Does that mean that barracks + theology + vassalage = 8 exp will give level 3 units out of the box? Not exactly.
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Post by Elledge on Jul 7, 2006 1:13:08 GMT -5
But I want my formation cavalry!
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Post by notagoodname on Jul 7, 2006 1:17:44 GMT -5
Actually it will give Level 3 units - level 3 units take 5 experience (they start at level 1) But you're thinking of level 4 units and that takes 10 exp anyway so no it won't quite get you a level 4 unit
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Post by notagoodname on Jul 7, 2006 1:28:21 GMT -5
I wonder if in the reassignment of leader traits there will be an angressive and charismatic leader?
May make it possible to get a small stack of commando promoted infantry (able to use enemy roads and railroads) in industrial games.
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Post by Ellestar on Jul 7, 2006 1:49:41 GMT -5
Catapults OWNED in Civ 4. And so they improved them even more in expansion And free Drill I-II so these catapults win 1v1 vs default catapults as well? SOS! OMGWTFPWNAGE is coming!
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Post by notagoodname on Jul 7, 2006 2:09:35 GMT -5
Ellestar i hoping that when they say it has 50% on cats that they actually lowered the cats strength. So 50% extra on a 3 or 4 strenth cat = 5or6 vs melee. I can live with that. Assuming of course they did drop the cats strength or at least changed the collateral damage rules so they weren't useful even in the ren era
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Post by Lestat on Jul 7, 2006 12:08:03 GMT -5
screw the nuts - wtf these dumbhols make us pay money for a patch I hear that u have pirated version.
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Post by Avogadro on Jul 7, 2006 12:09:40 GMT -5
Enough see you in 3 days Lestat.
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Post by mrsaturn on Jul 7, 2006 12:25:06 GMT -5
An aggressive and charismatic leader would seem a bit overpowering. Kinda like an industrius and philosophical leader.
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Post by Elledge on Jul 7, 2006 13:15:45 GMT -5
Enough see you in 3 days Lestat. That was a long time coming.
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Post by Tony on Jul 7, 2006 14:08:46 GMT -5
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Post by miserymachine on Jul 7, 2006 14:17:48 GMT -5
Catapults OWNED in Civ 4. And so they improved them even more in expansion And free Drill I-II so these catapults win 1v1 vs default catapults as well? SOS! OMGWTFPWNAGE is coming! It looks that way at face value but keep in mind that they said there are going to be trebuchets in the expansion. They are obviously going to appear after cats but before cannons and could take a lot of the punch out of getting those Hwacha, especially if they obselete cats as early as muskets become redundant, although those ottoman muskets make it an interesting and dangerous golden age if you can beeline there quickly in an anc game. At the least Ren games will be taking on a new major player.
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Post by Avogadro on Jul 7, 2006 17:24:25 GMT -5
He made another account, now his ip is blocked 7 days instead of 3. Thanks for bringing it to my attention.
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Post by whiplash on Jul 7, 2006 20:43:14 GMT -5
Whip please don't post other members pictures without there permission.
CS
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Post by lporiginalg on Jul 7, 2006 21:10:15 GMT -5
jesus im gonna have nightmares for a week
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Post by whiplash on Jul 8, 2006 0:34:21 GMT -5
Whip please don't post other members pictures without there permission. CS sheeeesh! It's the pic that he posted himself. It's in W2's thread. Anybody can go there right now and view it; I merely posted the link. It's not like I snuck up on him and took a snap. What permission is required after he volunteered to post his own image? I get censored for merely posting what is already in the "public domain"; yet in another thread it's apparently ok for somebody to call me an not a very nice person and infer that I have no knowledge of basic economics. It seems your censorship standards depends upon "who" not "what". And just who are you trying to protect with your censorship? This is a "member" who repeatedly exposes himself to ridicule due to the banality of his posts and has just been suspended from this forum.
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