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Post by MookieNJ on Jun 6, 2006 0:38:02 GMT -5
Here's part of the problem -- the event list was not released until 1 week before CCC. I generally play a lot of Renaissance because it's my favorite era, but I also intentionally played a good amount of Medieval and Industrial era games to practice for CCC. Then we find out 1 week prior to CCC that both of these eras were removed from CCC this time around.
How can we make ladder games more like CCC games if the CCC goes through such a big change?
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Post by MookieNJ on Jun 6, 2006 0:39:18 GMT -5
Also, with 9 events and 7 eras, there should be room for just about everything .
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Post by Canucksoldier on Jun 6, 2006 0:41:44 GMT -5
And we have to wonder if CCC is a World Civ Championship, or a ladder Civ Championship. Our goal is both, it's run for C4P which is striving to be a place for the world to play Civ4, we have a international membership, although some timezones seem to be more organized than others. I realize that there are smaller national/linguistic leagues as well, but I think we can offer something on a larger scale even for those communities. I'd certainly like to see more representation from other european and asian/australian communities in our events but I think that depends on the Civ community and the game maturing over time. Any suggestion on this are welcome. CS
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Post by Ellestar on Jun 6, 2006 0:55:25 GMT -5
I don't understand people who say : "we don't play this era in ladder games, so we don't have to play this in CCC". Until last CCC, I had never played any game in modern era. And I thought this era wouldn't be very interezsting. One week befoe CCC, I tried it, and even if the map was ridiculous, I realised that this era could be very interesting, and I enjoyed it. I think that instead of making the CCC look like ladder games, we should make the ladder games look like CCC. It is an occasion to discover eras or maps we are not used to play. And maybe, who knows, to enjoy it. Civ is very large, it would be a shame to use only a small part of it. And we have to wonder if CCC is a World Civ Championship, or a ladder Civ Championship. For that, we need to know events in advance. For example, one month before CCC instead of 5 days or so. But admins ignore our desires. I said exactly the same prior to first CCC i participated in (27th i think, more than 3 months ago).
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Post by venceslas on Jun 6, 2006 1:34:40 GMT -5
Maybe, it will be great to have a CCC with more events, maybe ten?
With ten events, it shoulld be possible to have all eras, and the most popular with two events.
chris.
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Post by Magzi on Jun 6, 2006 2:19:54 GMT -5
yes venceslas good in theory to have more events but some clans (ours included) seem to struggle to fill the number of events we have already! Then they all need a TD!
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Post by charliebrownparker on Jun 6, 2006 5:28:08 GMT -5
Then they all need a TD! Magzi we had enough TD for this CCC. Admins just don't have a look on TD forum that's all. I proposed to TD event 1 and 2. Tommynt proposed event 5. As you know I was very disappointed when SPM decided to TD every friday's events. Sending an email 12 hours before CCC start is not enough to do things properly. You can count on motivated players so please give them more consideration CCC has to be prepared 3 or 4 weeks before tournament. Please try to organize thinks earlier than usual. "Who will be TD" hasn't to be decided 1 hour before CCC start. I can understand Ellestar and Mookie. MDR players worked hard on Medie, 3vs3 Ren and Indus start during 1 month for nothing. One week to prepare tactics on new events is not enough. For next CCC french speaking league shall register a fourth clan. CCC is very popular on our ladder and we are obliged to refuse very motivated players in french clans. For example MDR could today propose 2 rosters with 8 players each. Each MDR is retricted to choose 2 event per players but mostly would play 4 events during CCC WE. Now we have to work all together to organize a worldwilde and popular tournament not only based on few influent players wishes.
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Post by venceslas on Jun 6, 2006 6:47:02 GMT -5
Well, I agree with you Magzi, one more event is obviously a problem for small clan. For big clan, one more event is good.
Why your clan is small?
Depending the answer, it's good or bad to have more events in my opinion.
chris.
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Post by everybodysdarling on Jun 6, 2006 6:48:38 GMT -5
I agree with civers, who think coming CCC events supposed to be published at least 1 week in advance. - Without discussion about settings, because there will be always som certain players (especially from my clan ;D) who don´t like some certain settings (like future ;D ) But in fact that would give all clans time to reconsider strategies, and focus on the coming games.
Cton style games part of the CCC?
Another old idea how to make the CCC more attractive is to create 1-2 cton style tourneys. There are a lot of cton experts in our league, who would be more than happy to be able to show their skills in the CCC. And because a cton game is played with only 1 participant of every clan, we could cover the big gams (4v4, 5v5) with a cton tourney played in the same time, and no clan will complain, that they cannot get players to play all events.
The only reason in my eyes why ctons are not part of the CCC , is that it is not possible to put a cton into this fancy tourney site with standings, teams etc. But like for ironman there are other solutions how to organize it.
With 10 participating clans, make 2 cton pre-elimination games, each with 5 players on any small map. 130 turns makes the game is finished after 2-3 hours. Best 2-3 players from every pre-elimination advance into the final game cton game. Now all you have to do is give the final cton game a fancy name (something like Ironman, i love it) and here we go. This would attract the CCC for many players i know and make the CCC more popular.
Please tell me what you think about it. If you like it. And if not, why?
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Post by charliebrownparker on Jun 6, 2006 6:59:04 GMT -5
there will be always som certain players (especially from my clan ;D) who don´t like some certain settings (like future ;D ) Who? ;D Got my own idea about it Cton event looks a good idea ebd. I like it. Few players involved and a lot of fun. It's quite similar to Ultimate event on Civ3 conquest that Swissy proposed.
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Post by eiffel on Jun 6, 2006 7:11:07 GMT -5
CCC Events settings need to be discussed. This would avoid us to play events that were not tested before putting them in the CCC... I'm thinking about Ancient 3v3 on ring in CCC31, or Modern 3v3 on pangea small in CCC29, or normal timer in 5v5 renaissance with barbs on Inland Sea... And I think too that CCC should propose a lot of different eras and settings... and more clans involved and more (fast) events in the CCC. For this, we need to advertise/explain the CCC and the ladder.
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Post by tommynt on Jun 6, 2006 7:39:10 GMT -5
eiffel and others I emailed SPM to organize this discussion meeting which should have been held prior to this ccc allready - gathering opinions in this thread is good but not enough imo
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Post by Ellestar on Jun 6, 2006 8:01:07 GMT -5
I agree with civers, who think coming CCC events supposed to be published at least 1 week in advance. - Without discussion about settings, because there will be always som certain players (especially from my clan ;D) who don´t like some certain settings (like future ;D ) But in fact that would give all clans time to reconsider strategies, and focus on the coming games. Week??? I say month, MONTH! What's the point to know it one week before CCC?
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Post by SirPartyMan on Jun 6, 2006 14:14:16 GMT -5
Thanks for your comments and suggestions re: the CCC events. Of course it's impossible to make everyone happy. Some prefer one map style over another or one era choice over another - and that's one of the things that makes our game interesting. I played in the ancient 3v3 and while we lost our game was quite good. Others mileage might vary.
I want to see us implement something that has worked well over on the CIV3 Ladder - a CCC Advisory Council. Each CCC the clan's that participate (9 this time) can each appoint one person to the Council to advise me on which events to schedule the next time with which rule set.
I will send out an email tonight to each of the 9 clans asking them to propose someone. We will then send up a limited access discussion thread here for the purpose of recommending and evaluating changes and we will announce the next CCC rules a minimum of 2 weeks before.
And everytime, in any event, I always read this thread and incorporate the changes that seem popular. I've added more non-ancient starts and rotated the eras.
Another example: this time we made the Renaissance 5v5 since many said this was a very popular game format.
Those of you who have good ideas = talk to your clan and get nominated to the CCC Advisory Council for the next time - to make this popular event even better.
Best, SPM
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Juni
Worker
Posts: 137
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Post by Juni on Jun 6, 2006 14:37:09 GMT -5
yes venceslas good in theory to have more events but some clans (ours included) seem to struggle to fill the number of events we have already! Then they all need a TD! The problem is not the number of events, but the schedule. Actually, only 4 players are needed on friday, while 10 are required for saturday (while the rules say that a roster must include 8 players min only). You see there is some place for a new event on friday. And there must be a change on saturday. 5v5 ren and 4v4 anc at the same time is impossible for many clans
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Post by longhorn on Jun 8, 2006 8:35:32 GMT -5
Listening to the CCC idea of incorporating a CTON to the tornament-- I think this could be a great idea.. but.. would it be possible to implement one change. Any possibility that the identity of the particular player/civ could be masked until the end of the game? For example.. you would know that there are 8 players in a cton with you, and even who they are and what clan they represent. But.. all you would know is that Egypt, Spain, Aztec, France, India etc are in the game with you-- the fact that tommynt is Napoleon or Game Theory is Ghandi would be withheld from you until the end of the game. This would prevent any targeting of specific players or clans, because you wouldnt know who they were until the game was over. It would also keep you on your toes the entire time wondering if that peaceful looking mali civ to your right is really Ironclad about to wipe your civ from the planet! Perhaps we could do one ancient style cton and one random era cton as a possible event? Other comments: I really liked the 5v5 event (and not just because we won it). I agree that some advanced notice is nice on the proposed events, however, I am not convinced that it is in the best interest for that information to be ultra specific. For example, definitely know that a 3v3 medieval event is part of the CCC-- however-- do the teams really need to know that its a 3v3 on team battleground? I kind of like the idea that you wouldn't know what map its on, whether or not it was pick or random civs, and whether or not barbs were on until much closer to the event. Make those teams practice all possible combinations and permutations if they are jobless and have 24/7 to play civ-- don't spoon feed them the whole thing in advance. I would also like to see more events span more eras, maybe even, at least one event form every single era. Come on, we know MUD is the champion of ancient.. no competition necessary to crown them that! Alternatively, make it pairs.. example even number CCC's have a 2v2 modern and odd CCC numbers have a 2v2 industrial. And finally, I advise against making the CCC something where the top two players in a clan can play every single event. Keep scheduling those events where a clan needs to make strategic decisions on what events to play, who to put in an event, etc. Otherwise its not a clan championship.. its an individual championship! Then again, what can you expect from the guy who proposed the random/random event to begin with. Thanks
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Post by lporiginalg on Jun 9, 2006 22:25:37 GMT -5
Regarding the lag in the ren era I just wanted to say that I have alot of respect for the FUN clan and the sportsmanship they showed. No one enjoys playing in a lagfest but opting for a concession because one player drops a few times in cheesy imo. I don't think a TD was ever notified of this prob during the game but I would like to think that if they were the decision made would be a temporary postponement of the game until the lagger can be subbed.
And btw mookie if I recall correctly Lord Elgis lagged at the start of every turn in our ren game vs you so it's not all that uncommon, luckily mark didn't play in that game or we would've had some real problems.
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Post by tommynt on Jun 12, 2006 9:38:44 GMT -5
SPM did u send these invitations out?
i didnt receive anything and i m cap aswell as ccc representive of MUD
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Post by eiffel on Jun 12, 2006 10:08:46 GMT -5
Moineau is CCC representative for LKT.
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Post by Canucksoldier on Jun 12, 2006 12:34:20 GMT -5
I'll look at the email I recieved as Captain of KC, and forward it to you guys if you didn't recieve it, but I know SPM emailed atleast one person in each clan and told them to forward it to others in there clan if they were not the right person.
CS
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