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Post by Sidhe on Jan 12, 2006 17:33:17 GMT -5
Whilst I understand I'm probably the only person on the ladder with any interest in physics or maths- bear with me- I just read an article in new scientist about a scientific peer reviewed paper that deals with the unification of Gravity with electromagnetism. www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=105915OK the theory is that by unifying electro/magnetism with gravity you can use it to produce high energy Tesla fields to overcome gravity. And thus be able to launch a space ship from Earth and then bend space/time so you can reach planets etc quicker, the moon in three days, Mars in a few weeks. Now this sounds like Star Trek, and I agree, but the International atomic energy association gave the guys (two German scientists) their award for that year. Whilst I'm skeptical myself I do believe all the forces: Electro/magnetism weak/strong are merely the same force at different energy levels, as Einstein tried to prove with his grand unification theory. Now if it proves to be true and we have already unified three forces electro/magnetism/weak(radiation) then Gravity is next, if we can do this we can use the theory that gravity bends space time to bend it and move faster than we could otherwise, in fact as they postulate faster than light(FTL) this theory sounds like a pipe dream, but NASA are interested, and are doing research into it. If it's not just BS, which unfortunately it might be, it might prove to be the foundation for interstellar travel. Take a look see what you think. I'm dubious but if true then expect interstellar space flight in the next 50 years. by the way the guy who invented the unification (Gerhard Heim) was contacted by the head of NASA in 1950, when he proposed the theory, he said is the Apollo program worthwhile or not? Not a ringing endorsement I think the theory has some merit as all forces can be unified, but make up you're own minds but it certainly is interesting
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Post by Sidhe on Jan 14, 2006 3:19:02 GMT -5
hehe. That's about as much as I expected in response. Physics is like talking Latin these days. Everyone knows where the country is but no one bar a few understand the language
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Post by umbra on Jan 14, 2006 3:24:53 GMT -5
Hey they stole my ide
ok thats the last time i am gona post my ides in civ3 fourm,
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Post by umbra on Jan 14, 2006 3:35:28 GMT -5
ok i like this kinda stuff man, or i mean i think about this kinda stuff without reading alor about it,
and not to destroy my future, i can tell you a bit,
no we cant bend space time as you say.
lol never. it cant be done, it may seem like we bend it, but we wont, it will be strait and fast if any.
finnaly pepole are starting to use those electro stuff to lift out of grav, but some thing pepole dont use yet,
geee i am gona do it over, gona spill a new tech in the civ fourm oh well, for human good,
ok Since you prolly know theres a - and a + to a magnetic thing.
now think about the moon as - and the earth as +
now since both the earth and the moon is diffrent, there should be more - than + on either of them, witch make them .
so IN Alugars theroy, you could build a "Ship" witch when turned on, by using a Electro magnetic puls feild, like tesla in a way but mutch mutch more energetic,
and you set the right freek you should be drawn to the moon until you are closer to it, than to earth. or also you could use the earth on magnetic feild to repulse you, and then be drawn to the moon. and then soo on out to others places.
this is the only way to travvel in space, at lest with is very low ion cost, and can go on forever
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reptile
Worker
in desperate need of a new avatar
Posts: 106
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Post by reptile on Jan 14, 2006 3:35:41 GMT -5
In fact, I read some of the sources your post leads to. But I just don´t get the math, and I barely get the principles of this theory. But then again, many of those on your forum have the same problem, so don´t expect us to do better . Btw, I´m all up for interstellar travel, the earlier the better!
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Post by Sidhe on Jan 14, 2006 3:56:55 GMT -5
hehe, I'm just messing you guys, don't mind me. Here's a brief history of a brief history of time style book. Gravity is attractive so the graviton(force carrier for gravity is attractive) The system uses electrons to create gravitophotons(which can be both just as magnets can have both attractive and repulsive properties) Also particles called virtual gravitophotons(or the quitessance particle/ vacuum particles) which are repulsive and strongly so(there called virtual because they exist for a ridiculously short amount of time). It uses Einsteins Theory of General relativity which states that all matter bends space/time according to it's mass. So for example we see an umbra in an eclipse that is larger than it should be if the light where traveling in a straight line, because the suns mass is bending space time we see a nice corona and a lovely larger umbra and penumbra. The shadow phase. This was proved during the last solar eclipse and before this in 1800's wasn't till Einsteins theory that they explained it. Now if you use the repulsive force of Gravitophotons you can propel a ship not by magnetism but by anti gravity. By creating a hugely repulsive force, similar to the repulsive force of the vacuum(Hubble constant is increasing which means space is expanding faster and faster, the virtual particles in a vacuum which exist for a time proportional to planks constant create a repulsive force it is thought by many) Now by creating a large enough mass you can bend the fabric of space around you so much that the distance between two points is shorter, then using the drive to travel at very fast speeds you can get to a planet or star much quicker. They actually state that if you bend space time you can travel into Hilbert space or Hyperspace and avoid the annoying implications of time dilation. As I say it's all alittle far fetched if by some chance it does work I can't say I'll be disappointed in eating humble pie. As for the equations there simply field equations for particles in 8 dimensions 4 normal dimensions and 4 sub space dimensions. This where we get into difficulty because these dimensions can't be measured like the 12 dimensions in string theory or the 24 in M(membrane) theory. It's kind of like trying to fit the math of the forces into the equation by inventing dimensions with length breadth and height and time we can fit the forces of gravity and Electromagnetism and the weak(radioactive force) but the other forces need some dimensional playing with to create very curved "spaces" to fit in the forces of electromagnetism weak and strong etc. They look to me to be mathematical manipulation and speculation. Interesting but little more than mathematical mas*****tion. And conveniently we can't perceive these dimensions so the theories are untestable. Which means String theory is little more than a hypothesis with a fancy name. The worst possible scientific theory is one that you can't prove wrong. This theory is testable simply because if they succeed in making a hyper drive it will be sufficient proof( good luck to them I really genuinely hope they are right) but I have my reservations. having said that as I said the guy was widely regaurded by his peers as being a genius which when you consider his peerd are the best German phsysists of his day is quite some accolade. Schrodinger/Einstein/oppenheimer etc etc. plank/bohr/De bruglie would probably found his theories intreaguing too. Where as E=mc^2 is an equation for 4 dimensions these are the same equation as E=mc^2 but in 8 dimensions. They predict the atomic mass of protons and electrons to within 1*10^-6 which is intersting but it's a possibility that there just reverse engineered to do this. Scientists have been trying to explain why an electron has 1048(forget the exact number) times less mass than a proton and a neutron for ages but have never really come up with anything concrete. Hey they stole my ide ok thats the last time i am gona post my ides in civ3 fourm, yeah but you stole the Idea from Heim anyway so be quiet www.uibk.ac.at/c/cb/cb26/heim...icsaip2005.pdfEdit: it only seems to work via that website though This link is the peer review paper. Ignore the math you don't need to understand it to get the gist of it
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