Juni
Worker
Posts: 137
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Post by Juni on Mar 9, 2006 19:08:57 GMT -5
In order to avoid such a situation for next CCCs, could it be possible to post the rules at least one week before the competition begins, and to MAKE NO CHANGE on it. If a debate on rules is necessary, pre-rules could be posted earlier, but it is a nonsense to change rules 1 day before the CCC.
I guess that tomorrow, many players will come to play the future start without having any idea of what kind of game they will have to deal with.
I know it is hard to organise such a competition, you do your best and we can only thank you, admins, for that, but please, don't do something like that again.
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Post by tommynt on Mar 9, 2006 20:17:39 GMT -5
might be a bit late now - but why not allow 1 member per team to go into these addable civics - espaiillay for ren this d be interesting - and for future kinda aswell
for the 1-1 event some rule on hosting might have been usefull - in 1-1 host advantage can decide games kinda often - maybe some rule like every1 can host only every 2nd game or so ...
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romazi
Settler
metabaron
Posts: 18
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Post by romazi on Mar 10, 2006 3:41:08 GMT -5
I agree with Juni. We don't know the standart practices used on your ladder. To know your rules at least one week before is fundamental for us. Please do not have resentment against Niluge. You can understand we spend a lot of time to train, and you know well that we, french people , never agree with nothing.
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Post by eiffel on Mar 10, 2006 5:50:10 GMT -5
Considering some civics are banned, how will be managed the situation where someone switches because he didn't read this forum, the rules well enough... or just forgot the ban and switched too quickly ? Is this a reload ? Is this disqualification ? About rules, why not making it clear for each event that : - the 3 civics are banned (in red). - No city razing is ON/OFF instead of using the odd/even that isn't clear for some non-english players, i'm never able to remember which event is odd or even ;D - maybe specify the barbs status for each event too.
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xma
Settler
Posts: 29
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Post by xma on Mar 10, 2006 7:54:27 GMT -5
Considering some civics are banned, how will be managed the situation where someone switches because he didn't read this forum, the rules well enough... or just forgot the ban and switched too quickly ? Is this a reload ? Is this disqualification ? eiffel raises an important point there.... nobody wants a drama about such issues.
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Juni
Worker
Posts: 137
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Post by Juni on Mar 10, 2006 11:25:39 GMT -5
Yes, good point Eiffel. And I'm afraid that in some games, players are going to make their own rules because they don't know or understand the official rules... How many different clans have posted in this thread ? Not all, for sure. What about the others ? Maybe they have not read this thread yet. Maybe they won't read it until the event starts. I don't know who is the TD, but I wish good luck to him / her
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Post by tommynt on Mar 10, 2006 12:09:01 GMT -5
The ban of the 3 civics is a universial lader rule - so i doubt there ll be descusions bout it - and u guys can talk to each other and ask td
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Post by SirPartyMan on Mar 10, 2006 13:30:25 GMT -5
I will update the rules to make it clear which games are no city razing. Please note this is not a rule change, merely a clarification since it was stated that some people were confused about the odd/even rule.
I also updated to make the Barbs on/off rule clear, but there is no change to the program.
By the way, we will be forming a CCC Advisory Council for future CCC's. We have something similar over on CIV3Players. Each clan will nominate one person to contribute ideas to this committee, which will meet to discuss future ideas/changes/additions to the CCC. The committee will present ideas - the most popularly accepted ones will be adopted.
Best, SPM
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Post by SirPartyMan on Mar 10, 2006 13:41:19 GMT -5
TDs will enforce rules and remind people accordingly. If someone changes civics by mistake, you should reload a turn back.
SPM
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Post by matth on Mar 10, 2006 17:47:02 GMT -5
Hello all
About the 1v1 event :
Last CCC i already post about the map wich makes that half of the game are simply stupid...
1) you can began on a stupid island of 2 or 3 tiles... What the hell is the goal of such a game ?
2)the host is the only one who know if he really choosed varied land mass type. Thats a really simple way of cheating for the host and no risk at all ( i dont think that any of my opponent did that but this trap should be removed anyway).
3) you can began on a stupid map where there is no ressource like in my 1v1 tonigth. On the whole map : no iron no copper... Imagine now a game versus Montezuma and his Jaguar (no iron or copper needed to build it)... Yes you can report your loss at turn 1... You cant win against Aztecs if there is no ressource. Cool next CCC : Mali vs Aztecs and Aztecs vs Mali and to change a bit : Mali vs Aztecs....
4) you can begin on a map were it's imposible to cross over the 2 tiles of ocean in the middle of the mirror. So no war... not even on water because culture cant take 2 tiles of ocean, only one. That was my map last ccc...
So after 2 stupid CCC like this (and i'm not the only one who had to play a stupid map, others were angry about the 2 tiles island too) could we please change the map to something a bit closer from what civ is supposed to be ? A game with iron or copper somewhere on the map, a game where you can meet each others, a game without that 2 tiles islands !
Excuse me if i'm a bit angry about all that but its the second time i loose on such stupid map. The third time i post and noone even answer me to my 2 first post about it. I hope this time the map will be change for the next ccc because this one is stupid half of the time.
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Post by Lestat on Mar 10, 2006 23:06:41 GMT -5
Before i played 1v1 CCC i tested map seting. In 5 start i have 4 two island strart and 1 cont. In that sepearte island start got 1 start on 3 square island. Yea veird map type must be changed. Suggest pangea next time.
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Post by markweston on Mar 11, 2006 6:26:17 GMT -5
Hmm. These are still Mirror maps right? So the "weirdness" applies to both players equally? So surely the player best able to cope with whatever circumstances he finds himself in, wins? I think that's what competitions like this are supposed to be about.
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Post by matth on Mar 11, 2006 11:09:51 GMT -5
Yes but on a map without any iron or copper the aztecs or Mali is overpowered and unbeatable... They have to win, no other way...
And anyway the problem is that such a game is not interesting at all and the issue is not about skill but about the civ you choose.
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Post by Atomation on Mar 11, 2006 16:59:16 GMT -5
Well, I love the whole idea of having championships, but there's a huge problem with CCC. It takes just way too long. This being my first ccc, I never realized how much time dedication it ends up being. Because of the shear quantity of teams, and the fact that having a high rank/rating gives me byes on the first round almost every time, I was only able to play 1 single game during the first two days of competition, despite being available for over 10 hours. Now I won't mock people that won't have lives - I envy that they can play 24/7, but I can't. 10 hours is quite a bit of time as it is! On saturday, the 11th (today as I am writing this), I got on at 1230 to be ready for the ren teamer at 1. Well, first round bye, and second round didn't start till after 5pm, at least (I don't fully know since I actually have to leave now). This is crazy! All the time I was just sitting around waiting for the other teams to show up. Its just not fun. I do have some suggestions to help, though: 1. Make preliminary "wildcard" matches for teams that don't have good rankings in weeks previous to ccc, so that we don't have more than 8 teams competing in any match. This alone will cut down on the time to play any particular setup, since it will only have 3 rounds. 2. Make all games but the ironman single city elim. Yes, I said it. I HATE CITY ELIM, but its necessary for the speed of the game . 3. 120 turns is just too much. There's no reason to force games to drag into defensive mode - make it 75 turns or 80 max. I have found very few games where the winner isn't already known by that time anyway. 4. Spread the competition out over several weeks rather than all in 1 weekend. If all setups have 3 rounds, could use a 3 week system, 1 round per week. In this way you NEVER have people waiting for others to finish the game for their next match! 5. If not a weekly system, perhaps a round per day system would be good. friday nights, round 1, saturdays round 2, and sundays round 3. This would limit how many events a player could compete in for the ccc, but isn't that only fair anyway? I think it would be more of a "team" effort if a person could only really participate in 1 or 2 events, rather than just a huge subfest. I realize you have a maximum participation rule, but its so loose that it hardly applies to anyone except the most hardcore 24/7 gamer.
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Post by notagoodname on Mar 11, 2006 19:53:48 GMT -5
atm u got it at the qualifier time which is totaly unplayable for euros - in addition u moved civ4 fut 3 hours later to make it even more unplayable for euros Heh the times are actually quite good for you Euros compared to us Aussies and East Asians. Here all of the Sunday events are going to run on into our monday morning. So it isn't just a matter of staying up late to play in them for me, i'd have to skip work (very tempting though )
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Post by markweston on Mar 11, 2006 20:08:57 GMT -5
Yes but on a map without any iron or copper the aztecs or Mali is overpowered and unbeatable... They have to win, no other way... And anyway the problem is that such a game is not interesting at all and the issue is not about skill but about the civ you choose. Don't agree with your first statement. I mean, I have some sympathy with anyone who ends up on a map with no metal; it's so unusual it's bound to be disconcerting. On the other hand chariots, horse-archers and elephants become proportinally more powerful in just the same was as Jaguars and Skirmishers do, and everyone has access to those. And I also disagree with both parts of your second statement. These different games are interesting precisely because they are different. And civ choice doesn't win the game for you; adapting your civ choice and your strategy to the circumstances you find yourself in is what wins for you. The whole point is that when you are playing with a random map like the Mirror/varied landform, you have to be flexible and think fast. Sticking to a standard template strategy repeating the same old build order you've used a hundred times won't get the job done. Which in a competition which is supposed to be a test of skill amongst the best players, is IMO a good thing. And finally, regarding the Aztecs and the lack of metal. The whole point about the Aztecs is that you're choosing a frankly inferior UU that you know, in most games, you'll never even use. What you're paying for (by accepting this crappy UU) is insurance against the time when you don't get metals. That's a strategic trade-off, that the player who - say - chooses Rome has specifically decided not to take. But if the player who chose Rome doesn't get his metal, I don't think he has the right to complain that the Jaguar is cheesy or unbalanced. Because if the Jaguar is to be considered unbalanced in the rare and only circumstances when it's useful, then there's no point having it in the game at all.
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Post by Avogadro on Mar 11, 2006 21:11:44 GMT -5
phitrigger.... Welcome to the CCC ;D Anyone who has won it will tell you it is a war of attrition. We are against preliminaries because the CC is the opportunity for all players to face off. The good, the bad and the ugly..everyone gets a shot come CC time. Past winners have gone 46 hours without sleep On another note, please no hub maps for iron man, very unbalanced, if someone is lucky enough to get early kill they have 2 hubs to grow into and quickly overpower the rest.
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Post by notagoodname on Mar 12, 2006 0:47:02 GMT -5
Ouch! I just noticed that you arn't supposed to report to the ladder, the tournament does it for you when the loss gets reported. I now have 2 loses for every 1 in every game lost in the tourny
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Post by Canucksoldier on Mar 12, 2006 1:04:09 GMT -5
Except the ironman and any other large FFA/cton game, cases can't do a 1v1v1v1v1v1v1...all in one round.
CS
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Post by lorddragon on Mar 12, 2006 4:07:22 GMT -5
Hey, good Ironman, just a couple of suggestions for next time.
First, can we have the option to use blazing? That game was DRAGGING, lol. With 11 you always get quite a bit of lag after all.
Second, how about the option of using pressed or solid instead of random for land mass? When it lands on natural it gives very random results, not the most balanced at times. For some reason about half of them were mostly solid, but some were just a spiderweb of land fingers in the ocean.
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