moineau
Warrior
Administrator
Posts: 330
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Post by moineau on Sept 22, 2006 8:04:57 GMT -5
We'll never refind a game funnier than futur on conquest , but futur civ4 is very fun too, one of the best era.
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Post by tommynt on Sept 22, 2006 9:01:56 GMT -5
future is a bit broken for me as it lags crazzy for me in later turns, winning on space race is somehow no fun, and attacking d be imposible if there was no lag. I dont like to be limited in options to play due to timer/lag
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Post by everybodysdarling on Sept 22, 2006 10:37:38 GMT -5
well true tommy. There is a lag especially when using nukes or a stack of bombers. But its just a technical issue of implementation or hordware problem of data transimission. It is not a concept failure of the future era
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Post by venceslas on Sept 22, 2006 11:23:47 GMT -5
I'm not sure that lag is the right word, lag is a problem, here it seems a programmer design choice(a bad choice in my view).
chris.
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Post by Tony on Sept 22, 2006 12:44:27 GMT -5
The reason why i say future is broken is because, future has always been about having SOOOO many options that the best could often beat the average 5v3. The fun in using diffrent units, is not the unit you use but the type of unit you use, all the units are the same interms of what they can do. (hope that makes sense)
Where are the cruise missles? Where is the clever stuff you do to trap a king? where are the patatroopers? where are the helicopters? I mean even the helicopters are normal land units WWWWTTTFFF, its bad enough seige weapons being just normal units but helicopters aswell? When you start a game you think to yourself, shall i try cavarly rush? shall i try dropping drafted tows? shall i try to quickly get resource and get 2 move unit out or bomber? Shall i get a gran first? or am i feeling crazy enough to try and get a unit?
Where has the micromanagment gone, working your land to have a good combination between food( get city big fast-ish) and production?
Making massive mfg was only do-able by the best players, it was a real skill, now you build workshops on every tile and work your food, maybe irrigate the odd tile here and there!
Also making gold to rush improvments was also another skill which could be used to rush nuke or units or whatever!
There was a massive balance you had to strike between growth, units, rushing, exploring(VERY IMPORTANT - this would often dictate how you will play the game), etc etc.
Whose that have not played C3C dont know what this could have been and what it has become! I would be SHOCKED if even 1 player says civ4 future is even half as good as its predessor!
But im not one to cry over spilt milk, whats done is done, if you guys are happy playing it hf and gl, if not maybe we can make it a little more bearable with a mod maybe? who knows?
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Post by ironclad on Sept 22, 2006 13:22:58 GMT -5
no doubt civ3 future is better even with its bugs
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moineau
Warrior
Administrator
Posts: 330
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Post by moineau on Sept 22, 2006 13:25:00 GMT -5
For sure a civ4 futur mod like civ3 futur would be very very very fun.
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Post by tommynt on Sept 22, 2006 20:47:35 GMT -5
tony describes it very good, building up required so much more skill then it does now - that was really fun and a challenge - i did need loads of games toget even the basics but there was something to learn in like every game.
the civ4 learning curve is just very much different from civ3 learning curve - not only in fut
civ3 curve just allways went up in kinda same degree civ4 is kinda steep in start and then very flat - i think i can play ancient close to perfect sometimes now and see others being able to do same (there are allways unknown factors which make a perfekt game imposible)
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stin
Settler
Posts: 39
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Post by stin on Sept 23, 2006 11:02:48 GMT -5
The big difference between c3c future and civ4 future is what you start with. In civ3 you start with 1 settler and 1 worker and a king. Its all about fast build up. The best players build up quicker and still manage to attack or rush somebody.
Civ4 takes most of that out of the equation. Loads of buildings are already built and you have 3 settlers etc. Having played civ3 all eras and civ4 all eras i must say the best game is civ3 future. If only it had hotjoining, gifting of units, team mates starting together and being able to see what team is doing.
And I miss the early boat with cruise and tow. It was such fun trying to find their king in early part of game and take him out with surprise cruise.
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Post by everybodysdarling on Sept 24, 2006 7:49:35 GMT -5
Hmmm ive never played c3c, so i dont know the king part at all. It sounds fun. Maybe the developers could use these c3c future ideas and the civ4 techniuqe to build a new civ4 expansion pack. It can`t be that hard and alot of old c3c players would come back to civ...
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Post by tommynt on Sept 24, 2006 12:22:43 GMT -5
a explorer could be as useful as 5 tanks ^^
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Post by civerdan on Sept 26, 2006 14:55:49 GMT -5
"Explorer pillaging cheese" was one thing I dont miss in civ 4. As well as the cheese kill with an obsolete units (i.e. War Chariot), but I agree overall civ 3 future required for skill.
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Post by Tony on Sept 26, 2006 15:02:50 GMT -5
Hmmm ive never played c3c, so i dont know the king part at all. It sounds fun. Maybe the developers could use these c3c future ideas and the civ4 techniuqe to build a new civ4 expansion pack. It can`t be that hard and alot of old c3c players would come back to civ... Indeed a explorer could be as useful as 5 tanks ^^ Indeed "Explorer pillaging cheese" was one thing I dont miss in civ 4. As well as the cheese kill with an obsolete units (i.e. War Chariot), but I agree overall civ 3 future required for skill. This has not been the case for almost 2 years!
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Post by ironclad on Sept 26, 2006 19:13:31 GMT -5
future in civ4 is command and conquer generals go play that if you like this type of gameplay
civ is about building cities and structure improvments
civ4 future u make cities and units woohooo
and so much strategy is taken out compared to civ3... you can see the whole map with one plane how dumb is that?
spies are slowed in civ4 i think
no crusie missles.. cant bomb roads? how slowed is that
and a settler takes ONE turn in future which is slowed, shouldnt start with all those improvments... extra settlers i geuss is ok but 2 max
and the maps need to be bigger.. civ3 you couldnt see the whole map with one plane...
Future i believe should be played on.. standard for 3v3 Fractal Large for 4v4 Fractal Huge for 5v5 or more
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Post by tommynt on Sept 27, 2006 10:44:20 GMT -5
in fact game designers did some very weired thing to make settler cost 60 shields and delay grow for like 1 turn and u get for that 5 guys and improvements worth more then 600 shields.
That must be the most overpowered unit ever put into a strategy game.
Somehow it might be interesting how a 1 settler 1 scout start d work out in civ4 fut. guess it s not too hard modable to hide map and do some unit changes. I guess a king ll not be modable but
but then there is that other problem that playing mods in civ4 suckz so bad, is superanoying with all this restarting and other problems
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Post by churchill1 on Sept 27, 2006 14:31:45 GMT -5
you can see the whole map with one plane how dumb is that? Slight exaggeration but this is my biggest complaint as well.
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Post by Tony on Sept 27, 2006 15:59:17 GMT -5
I made this exact piont when neco sent me a mod with fog of war added. I said exps are silly because allies can put units/planes in firendly cites so as soon as somsone gets oil the whole map is visable within a few turns.
I also agree with iron, the maps are way too cramped for future fighting over large distances has never been a problem in future, but as is the nataure of CIV4's tic-tac-toe apprach bigger maps would make them a total build fest!
I belive somsone was making a future mod with a king but i guess he couldnt?
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Post by willburn on Nov 29, 2006 19:15:46 GMT -5
Spiritual is a must for future. Some day maybe I will write a guide why slavery is so awesome in future. Also universal suffrage is good too..the thing is you switch between em. Slavery early..get cash and if your not upgrading you go universal suffrage and burn up the cash.
Trust me on this one. Slavery owns future. Spiritual owns future. 3 move workers own future.
In a 3v3 or higher i think one guy going philosophical is great too. Then wonders start to shine.
I havnet played for a while so i havent tried it out in the current enviroment but it seems spacerace +defence is the prevailing tactic at the moment (or so ive been told) and I belive a good slaver will CRUSH any such defensive attempts as he will have far more units.
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Post by willburn on Nov 29, 2006 19:28:06 GMT -5
About civ3 vs civ4 future i cannot comment this as i didnt play activily mp civ3. But on general i can say i enjoy civ4 future..they are very fast and furious. In my playstyle i have like max 0.5 sec to make decisions for each of my workers (and there are actually options considered) i usually barly manage to finish my turns with all units moved. And for me this is fun as it pressures me to think fast. I kinda agree fighter has a very high line of sight and I do abuse this to its fullest if i expand mad to make sure nobody is attacking me that turn in weaker parts of my empire. Also tommynts comment on the settler beeing incredible powerfull in future is spot on - its such an incredible bargin getting so much for just 67 hammers. If they want to turn down the pace of futures make the city pop limit lower, or reduce number of starting settlers.
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Post by cv431410 on Nov 29, 2006 22:27:31 GMT -5
About civ3 vs civ4 future i cannot comment this as i didnt play activily mp civ3. But on general i can say i enjoy civ4 future..they are very fast and furious. In my playstyle i have like max 0.5 sec to make decisions for each of my workers (and there are actually options considered) i usually barly manage to finish my turns with all units moved. And for me this is fun as it pressures me to think fast. I kinda agree fighter has a very high line of sight and I do abuse this to its fullest if i expand mad to make sure nobody is attacking me that turn in weaker parts of my empire. Also tommynts comment on the settler beeing incredible powerfull in future is spot on - its such an incredible bargin getting so much for just 67 hammers. If they want to turn down the pace of futures make the city pop limit lower, or reduce number of starting settlers. After first 10 turns, you really only need to make sure you build enough workshops; other than that, the workers really should be automated. If workers do not behave as you expected, use quantity to compensate quality. There are a lot more activities in the future games so managing workers should not be one of your tasks.
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