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Post by SirPartyMan on Nov 8, 2006 10:35:10 GMT -5
Dear Friends:
I am going to post the rules and schedule for CCC 39 in the next 24-48 hours. I would appreciate any suggestions for changes, especially in light of the new patch.
Specific questions:
a) should any civs be banned from competition, e.g. Russia in Rennaissance play?
b) any new game options which have important settings?
c) any other suggestions you like.
Best, SPM
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Post by MMV on Nov 8, 2006 11:25:02 GMT -5
OMG he's back!!!!
Welcome home SPM
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Post by Bantams on Nov 8, 2006 11:45:35 GMT -5
some OCC games might be nice since they are becomming more popular than ctons at the moment
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Post by longhorn on Nov 8, 2006 11:51:41 GMT -5
As I posted in length the reasons- for this CCC ban Spain as well as Russia. For the next CCC we can work on all the rest - for the Ren teamer. Consider increasing turns to 110 or even more, or consider returning this event back to the 5v5 format. Perhaps slightly move events around so that the singles events alternate with the teamers as best as possible and/or the 2v2's run closer to the 3v3 as opposed to the majority of 3v3's being on the same day. An example here might be, kick the CCC off with a teamer as opposed to the classic singles event. Reduce amount of allowable subs in Ironman to 0, 1, or 2 (MAX). 5 subs, thats not an ironman If allowing subs, consider doing it in benchmark years only.. such as its 1850 and we will pause game for 10 minute break and allow substitutions at this time. Do not allow a clan to quit this event until their civ is eliminated, or face penalty- so no one gains an AI advantage. Ban spys as there appears to be some exploit with them. thanks, -lh
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moineau
Warrior
Administrator
Posts: 330
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Post by moineau on Nov 8, 2006 12:16:10 GMT -5
Why not do like on civ3 and dont allow 2 teams to pick same leaders in a teamer? We have often, in a 3vs3 for example, the 3 same teams which fight.
Where is the pleasure of the strategic pick on civ3? ( for ancien for example: asteque, then zoulou then maybe celt or egy or maybe iroqs etc...)
Why not put, instead of the actual Cton, an Ultimate Cton like on civ3, where each clan can register all players they want and we do for example 10 games of 5 players where all first can acceed to a final, that was fun in time.
Maybe put a 2vs2 modern sunday at 4am or something like that?
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Post by MookieNJ on Nov 8, 2006 13:16:26 GMT -5
Here are a few ideas that I posted in the CCC AC Forum (with no extra views than my own I guess it's safe to assume nobody goes there anymore ): Anyways, a few thoughts on the upcoming CCC. I think we have a really great, balanced formula down for the event list. It does a great job representing a lot of what we play here on the C4P ladder and I hope that it also represents a lot of the game types that our friends from CivFr enjoy. Event 1 -- 1v1 -- no changes needed Event 2 -- 3v3 Future -- should try to come up with a new map again Event 3 -- CTON -- split into two rounds, 5-6 players each on small Inland should work Event 4 -- 3v3 Indus -- changing the map to small Ring isthmus width of 3 tiles could be more interesting, allowing more ground attacks along with the naval strategies that are so prevalent Event 5 -- Ironman -- no changes needed Event 6 -- 3v3 Ancient -- Change the map to C4F TBG to eliminate the randomness of resources, or make the event 2 city elimination to make it less risky to settle quickly for a resource. Event 7 -- 3v3 Ren -- no changes needed Event 8 -- 3v3 Medi -- no changes needed Event 9 -- 3v3 Class -- good addition, no changes needed Event 10 -- Random/Random -- no changes needed Event 11 -- 2v2 OCC -- no changes needed I don't see any reason to unban Russia -- I am not looking forward to the Catherine, Peter, Stalin vs. Catherine, Peter, Stalin era. I don't think there is any reason to ban Spain. We won one round of Levi's Ren COT with no Ivory in our borders, and another round with only 1 Ivory and the other team's Spain in the middle. But I'm very tired of this topic and the ill will it has generated and have no desire to discuss it further. It's been my experience that nearly all of the CCC events have slightly lower turn limits than their regular ladder game counterparts. Increasing the number of turns is an awful idea. In Levi's tournament over the weekend, we played 4 rounds in about 5 hours, and sat around waiting for opponents for the other 7 hours. We never had a bye. Do we really need to lengthen these already long tournaments any further? With players from across the world participating, I say no. After 2 long days of Civ and 4 events already scheduled on Sunday, I don't think this would be feasible.
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Post by Speaker on Nov 8, 2006 14:11:28 GMT -5
It's been my experience that nearly all of the CCC events have slightly lower turn limits than their regular ladder game counterparts. Increasing the number of turns is an awful idea. In Levi's tournament over the weekend, we played 4 rounds in about 5 hours, and sat around waiting for opponents for the other 7 hours. We never had a bye. Do we really need to lengthen these already long tournaments any further? With players from across the world participating, I say no. Agreed. We already spend more time waiting than playing. In my experience, an extra 20 turns will make very little difference to the outcome.
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Post by tommynt on Nov 8, 2006 17:45:11 GMT -5
generally speaking there should be: - a bit less turns espacially in later eras. 60-70 turns in indu take 3 hours whats easyly enough for example. - the return of the civpicking only either 1 civ or 1 leader for room not for teams at least in like half the events - clear rules what to do with some1 lagging badly - clear rules about offensive flaming behaviour (there s no way that some1 have to let himself get insulted just cause he want to play ccc) - overall last scedule was kinda ok I think, not to many at least no drastic changes - I think tbf and/or pang should be used in more events. Teambattlefield was just designed for the type of games we play, it s a good map for every era espacially for early ones. pang is just the map feeling most like playing civilisation. U can cross map from back and such stuff. It d for example also fit for the random era event. There was like no ccc where no clan was complaining about unfair map in this event, maybe listen in end to all these guys and change map. also mirror is a kinda good map which could be used in more then 1 event, just not in future. - Also I think allowing space again in fuutre is way to go but then i m no future expert. At least is space race better as the lag festvals u get by having nukes as only option to win - I m not too sure about how many players all clans can offer but 1 or 2 events with 4 man teams might be nice. At least 1 "biggame" as we had in civ3, with 4 or 5 man teams; either ren or ancient era - I kinda agree to longhorn that 1 bit bigger event off the time from the 1-1 might be good. Friday evening is kinda the time with most players on (even when i cant play at this time )
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Post by MMV on Nov 8, 2006 18:31:20 GMT -5
how about an equal number of "singles" events as teamer events? (I haven't counted, maybe there are....)
(I ALWAYS loved the ironman "prequalification round" for ironman in the C3 CCC's, more than the actual ironman itself, - they were always a FAST all-out KILL'EM'ALL kinda game, lol)
so anyway, how about more "singles" events between the teamers that would allow others to play that aren't, can't, or couldn't get into their clans team?
since it's a single's match (one player per each clan) schedule them right after a teamer starts for some variety on on friday afternoon (EST), saturday morning (EST), saturday afternoon (EST), and saturday evening (EST)
too me, and in an ongoing effort to maintain times most convenient for everyone, there always seems to be a "lag" and lack of games during the timeframes I mentioned above. indeed, I think for a teamer, it's difficult to arrange convenient time-frames for all involved, but there ARE individual players from all over the world that play 24 hours a day.
Maybe use the C4F mod OCC as one of the singles matches too, and classical, etc etc
(yes, I know that the number of TD's is an issue here, but we could get more/new (maybe less experienced) TD's for these singles events?)
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Post by MookieNJ on Nov 8, 2006 19:17:32 GMT -5
We already have 3 events for singles -- 1v1 on Friday, Cton on Friday, and the Ironman on Saturday. Out of 11 events total, I think this is a pretty good percentage of events in what is a clan competition.
I know there's been talk of a World Singles Championship or something of that nature -- I think that's where the majority of the single player events should be held. The CCC is a clan competition, and should stress teamwork over the superiority of a single player.
With a 6 player minimum and a 20 player maximum, adding a ton of additional events would force the smaller clans to skip events and / or add a ton of new players. Adding new players to existing clans limits the number of new clans that will be formed. I think the goal of the CCC should be to have as many clans competing as possible rather than forcing the creation of 5 or 6 mega-clans.
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Post by MMV on Nov 8, 2006 20:15:49 GMT -5
a - 3 out of 11 isn't really a good percentage (if I thought so, I wouldn't have suggested different)
b - players ALWAYS represent their clan and this wouldn't change
c - it's a suggestion, not a requisite (no one would be forcing you to play in them or give up teamers)
d - suggestions are what was asked for here
e - mook! mook! mook!
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Post by MookieNJ on Nov 8, 2006 21:10:05 GMT -5
I know suggestions are being asked for here, I'm just disagreeing with one .
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Post by tommynt on Nov 9, 2006 4:00:01 GMT -5
I was allways a fan of adding some "small" events ide; so that every timeframe of ccc weekend is covered and that every1 in clan can play, but then these additional events d really screw small clans and the pointing system
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Post by MMV on Nov 9, 2006 5:52:27 GMT -5
I was allways a fan of adding some "small" events ide; so that every timeframe of ccc weekend is covered and that every1 in clan can play, but then these additional events d really screw small clans and the pointing system it could do that to small clans, but then again, it could interest newer players to join a clan and play events other than the (DOOT'dee'DOO....) TEAMERS! (and it could also influence clans to take ON a few newer players) But, I'd have to agree with mookie, it's only a suggestion.... lol
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moineau
Warrior
Administrator
Posts: 330
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Post by moineau on Nov 9, 2006 11:09:16 GMT -5
It is a good idea to reduce the numbers of turn in events
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Post by ironclad on Nov 9, 2006 12:32:38 GMT -5
I heard someone say lower turns below 100-90 thats pretty ridiculous, 90 turns is far as down i would go for a fair result. If you want a quick game for quick results play age of empires, I would like to see full games in ccc if possible
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Post by ironclad on Nov 9, 2006 12:35:28 GMT -5
maybe we can do a 10-30 turn event for those who desire it just to be fair, or maybe a one turn event those are always fun
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Post by ironclad on Nov 9, 2006 12:42:08 GMT -5
on the cton issue, I think the big cton with all 13 clans would be much more fun and thrilling and see nothing wrong with it probabaly will be around 10-11 clans when it starts anyhow which is a decent number, much more fun than playing two games
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Post by notagoodname on Nov 9, 2006 23:07:10 GMT -5
Space the events out evenly. If there are 12 events over 48 hours then have an event every 4 hours. Simple as that.
Proposed times and the equivalents using even spacing between events:
(New York)................(London).............(Moscow).........(Seoul) Friday 4pm................=Friday 9pm........midnight Friday 8pm................=Sat 1am............Sat 4am Friday midnight.........=Sat 5am.............Sat 8am Saturday 4am...........=Sat 9am Saturday 8am...........=Sat 1pm Saturday midday......=Sat 5pm Saturday 4pm...........=Sat 9pm Saturday 8pm Saturday midnight Sunday 4am Sunday 8am Sunday midday
Too lazy too figure out the whole table but you get the idea, there will always be a group of ladder players awake or who could be awake with some planning if you just space the events evenly.
The ladder is international, we have an asian clan and there are plenty of australians. There are also plenty of Eastern europeans and russians. Arthur Rodrigues told me there's brazillian south american players (and a brazillian is a lot of players!).
So space the times out evenly.
The current 4-5 events bunched up together on a sunday morning means that most clans can't feild a team anyway. So i'd be guessing even the western euros and yanks wouldn't mind even spacing between the events.
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Post by swissy on Nov 10, 2006 7:49:28 GMT -5
I'd like to see one of the teamers with non-duplicate leaders and civs. Perhaps one of the Sunday events, so that you get a benefit for accumulating points in the first two days.
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