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Post by SirPartyMan on Sept 29, 2006 21:04:42 GMT -5
Dear Friends:
This is the thread for you to make suggestions regarding CCC 37.
We have minimal changes this time - mostly changes to some maps and era starts and minor tweaks as suggested by posters in this forum.
Best, SPM
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Post by MookieNJ on Sept 29, 2006 21:21:03 GMT -5
Lineup looks good SPM. Just a couple suggestions:
Event 4 -- In Vanilla Civ Redcoats are pretty overpowered. That makes for a 2 Englands + 1 civ vs. 2 Englands + 1 civ in just about every round. I suggest moving this event over to Warlords where the Redcoats were reduced in power. If this is not possible I suggest banning England in this event.
Event 9 -- Sunday Ancient Start, era Classical -- I think this needs to be renamed the Sunday Teamer or something to avoid confusion.
Event 11 -- Since this is a Renaissance era event, should Russia and their Cossacks be banned like in the other Ren event, or will we be seeing the Russia/Russia tandem from most teams?
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moineau
Warrior
Administrator
Posts: 330
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Post by moineau on Sept 30, 2006 2:18:25 GMT -5
-Change map of event 10, shuffle can make game so boring.
-Uncheck "no city rasing" on event 4, indus.
-Maybe one more event friday at 6pm? on civ3 we had 15 events in the better ccc i have seen.
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Post by Bantams on Sept 30, 2006 2:30:45 GMT -5
Why bother using Vanilla Civ nobody plays it anyway
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Post by Ellestar on Sept 30, 2006 2:54:07 GMT -5
Friday Future Start Map: Small Mirror 1 continent per team. Era: Future - space victory is excluded (this rule will alternate from one CCC to another for foreseeable future). There is no "one continent per team", there are "snaky continents" and "wide continents". IMHO it will be unplayable at all with these settings. Everyone gets an absolutely equal continent, Space is off, defence is significantly powerful than attack in Future. IMHO it will be a very boring game. I think Future/No Space maps should be at least partially a land maps (with a land passage between players). Why not to make it Inland Sea? It's tested in ladder and fun.
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Post by MookieNJ on Sept 30, 2006 3:39:49 GMT -5
If you play on Wide Continents each team should start on their own continent that is a mirror of the other. If not, it's still mirror so each team gets the same start .
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Juni
Worker
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Post by Juni on Sept 30, 2006 4:43:44 GMT -5
I see pretty good ideas in this schedule. The new future event will probably be very interesting, and I like the idea of Ren era for OCC too.
But are you sure that a Pangea-like map is the best idea for this ? Ren won't avoid rushes and very short games like it happened last CCC on classical. Are C4F maps balanced for later eras ressources ? If they are, what about using C4F Islands for OCC ?
EDIT : accordint to mookie's last post, mirror can in some case put teams on the same continent for future evebt. It is a problem IMO. A future can not be played this way. Maybe you could add a rule and say that in such a case, the game must be rehosted. Or change the map to a TBG left v. right that is quite similar, but is unfortunately not a mirror map (which is a very good idea since ressources are so important in future)
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Post by MookieNJ on Sept 30, 2006 9:51:46 GMT -5
EDIT : accordint to mookie's last post, mirror can in some case put teams on the same continent for future evebt. It is a problem IMO. A future can not be played this way. Maybe you could add a rule and say that in such a case, the game must be rehosted. Or change the map to a TBG left v. right that is quite similar, but is unfortunately not a mirror map (which is a very good idea since ressources are so important in future) Juni -- every time I've played Mirror Wide Continents it's turned out to put each team on it's own identical continent, and like the Mirror Lakes map each team member starts in the same locations on the continent. Just start 20 games in a row or something with these settings and see how it turns out? If it's bad I'm sure SPM will change it .
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Post by charliebrownparker on Sept 30, 2006 12:03:25 GMT -5
Your schedule looks balanced and quite fun. Good job SPM Just few questions about events 4 and 12. On event 4 (indus) i agree to ban england on civ4 vanilla but it will be better to ban russians too. Cossacks are too powerful. Regarding event 12 (OCC on renaissance) please ban Saladin. It's too easy to cut some Meharists because they don't need iron nor horses. Meharist rush would be a deadly issue.
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Juni
Worker
Posts: 137
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Post by Juni on Sept 30, 2006 14:21:03 GMT -5
Juni -- every time I've played Mirror Wide Continents it's turned out to put each team on it's own identical continent, and like the Mirror Lakes map each team member starts in the same locations on the continent. Just start 20 games in a row or something with these settings and see how it turns out? If it's bad I'm sure SPM will change it . It seems that I misunderstood you. Sorry
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Post by MookieNJ on Sept 30, 2006 16:41:22 GMT -5
Your schedule looks balanced and quite fun. Good job SPM Just few questions about events 4 and 12. On event 4 (indus) i agree to ban england on civ4 vanilla but it will be better to ban russians too. Cossacks are too powerful. Regarding event 12 (OCC on renaissance) please ban Saladin. It's too easy to cut some Meharists because they don't need iron nor horses. Meharist rush would be a deadly issue. I'm guessing Meharist is French for Camel Archer? For Event 4 I agree with Charlie if we keep the event in Vanilla Civ. Cossacks have good odds against Rifles. However, if we move the event over to Warlords as has been suggested in a poll, then there is no reason to keep Russia out of the event, as Cossacks are no more powerful than regular Cavalry against Rifles. Charlie also brings up a good point for Event 12 that I hadn't thought of earlier. With the same map settings as the Classical OCC we played in the last 2 CCC's, the teams will be close enough that it will be very easy for Arabia to get Camels to the opponent almost immediately. I know that Eiffel's map does a great job balancing out the resources, but there's no guarantee that Iron or Ivory will be close enough for an immeidiate hookup, which is what you need when dealing with Camels. We often ban Arabia when we play Renaissance start on TBG map, and I think we have reason to do so here to keep the game more competitive.
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Juni
Worker
Posts: 137
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Post by Juni on Sept 30, 2006 17:36:12 GMT -5
I'm guessing Meharist is French for Camel Archer? Yes it is OCC map has clearly to be changed. What's interesting in OCC IMO is getting better than your opponent because you micro-manage better your only city. On this map, there is almost no micro managing, there are only farms, mines, production, units, units, units and units again. No fun in it.
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Post by knupp on Oct 1, 2006 1:12:28 GMT -5
I don't agree with you at all Juni. You should be able to balance units and gnp. If this map is changed to islands will only be going astro first and gangbang boating 1 guy. Not fun when there is only one strategy to go.
However when you play OCC's mod map you have to balance gnp and mfg if you want to win which imo requires a lot more skill.
Also for this event...Russia and Salidin should be banned. Russia for obvious reasons, you get cavs quicker than rifles and cossacks plow through regular cavs. Salidin because even on the OCC Mod Map (where you get all strategic resources within 7 tiles) your iron could be outside your capital until your border expands for the third time which takes a while.
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Post by churchill1 on Oct 1, 2006 4:50:53 GMT -5
you have to balance gnp and mfg if you want to win which imo requires a lot more skill. That's why ctooon and ancient teamers require the mostest skillz.
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Post by charliebrownparker on Oct 1, 2006 7:12:35 GMT -5
I'm guessing Meharist is French for Camel Archer? Ouuups ;D. Camel archer for sure. However, if we move the event over to Warlords as has been suggested in a poll, then there is no reason to keep Russia out of the event, as Cossacks are no more powerful than regular Cavalry against Rifles. So no need to ban england on civ4 warlords too. Redcoats are not so efficients on warlords mod. @ SPM. I have some new comments about CCC37 schedule. Could you please mention map size on event 10 3vs3 classique? Small i presume. Please also add on OCC rules "One City Challenge : checked". If this option is unchecked players will start with 2 settlers and they wont be able to built Oxford university too. It should avoid noobs as i'm to found on second city thanks
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Post by Ellestar on Oct 1, 2006 12:10:14 GMT -5
I don't know, maybe reduce a number of turns in a Future teamer? 80 turns until the end will suck sooo much. We may have up to 400-500 units from both sides at that moment, it will be extremely laggy and boring. 50 turns is more than enough. Say, we launched space in 31-40 turns. There is no need to prolong it to 80 turns.
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Post by Ellestar on Oct 2, 2006 1:54:38 GMT -5
SirPartyMan? I said it several days ago, there is no "Map: Small Mirror 1 continent per team". It's either "Map: Small Mirror Snaky Continents" or "Map: Small Mirror Wide Continents". Please clarify.
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Post by SirPartyMan on Oct 2, 2006 8:07:10 GMT -5
Thanks everyone for your feedback. I have made the following changes which are posted on the official final Rules and Schedule.
1) Event 4 will be played with Warlords - goodbye Vanilla CIV4. No civs banned.
2) Event 2 (Future) will be on Map: Small Mirror Wide Continents and 60 turns max.
3) Event 11 - banned Russia and Saladin
4) Events 9 & 10 - clarified SMALL map
5) Event 4 - No City Razing unchecked
Have Fun Everyone!
Best, SPM
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moineau
Warrior
Administrator
Posts: 330
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Post by moineau on Oct 2, 2006 11:06:47 GMT -5
Event4 was already no city razing unchecked, you confirme that is "unchecked" and no "checked"?
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Post by SirPartyMan on Oct 2, 2006 11:36:32 GMT -5
Actually when this morning began, Event 4 (Industrial) had no city razing checked. This was based on the poll where people felt No city razing was a good option for latter era starts.
However, on the strength of your recommendation, I changed it to unchecked. It seems to me that people don't play with No City Razing checked very often, any more.
So, yes, I confirm it is unchecked - not checked. When you take a city it will disappear.
SPM
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